Writing Groups
Jul. 3rd, 2008 02:02 am![[identity profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/openid.png){kind=small}
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lkh_lashoutsI don't actually object to this advice. It's sensible. I've read it in a dozen or so "Advice to Writers" books.
No, the advice makes sense. It's Laurell's hypocrisy that bothers me, for she manifestly doesn't believe some of this and creatively interprets other bits.
Entry: Writing groups
Link: http://blog.laurellkhamilton.org/2008/07/writing-groups.html
We keep getting asked how to tell if a writing group is a good group.
Really? Who asks? Because according to a previous post of yours, you only recently went back to a writing group after three or four years away.
First, are people actually writing, or just talking about writing.
End a question with a question mark.
Talk is great, and if all you want to do is hang out with other people that want to talk about writing that’s fine, but be wary. Writers don’t just talk about writing; they write.
...says the woman who's been complaining since February about not being able to write a certain scene.
Second, sometimes it’s hard to be in a group if you write genre of any kind. A lot of writing groups are sort of snoppish.
I don't know if she means "snappish," "snobbish" or is trying to create a portmanteau word meaning both.
Any group that tells you that what you want to write is bad just because it’s horror, or science fiction, or romance, or mystery, or any other genre, is not the group for you. Don’t let anyone talk you out of what you know in your heart is what speaks to your muse. If the group doesn’t approve of your type of writing, then find a different group.
On the other hand, lots of groups specializing in genre writing exist, so finding a group that favors your kind of writing shouldn't be that hard.
Third, beware of sharks. Sharks are people that are just in the group to draw blood. They do nothing but criticize in the most vicious terms. They say they’re giving you constructive criticism and trying to help, but trust me, sharks are interested only in destruction and hurting. Some sharks throw off all pretense and begin to attack the writer personally, and not the writing. These are people that are only interested in causing you pain. Any group that tolerates people like this you do not want to be a part of.
Why, Lashers! I do believe she's talking about us!
Fourth, the group that only says good things. If you’ve written something good, then it’s nice to know, but no one is perfect, especially at the beginning. If you get nothing but praise then you can’t improve your writing, because you don’t have any feedback telling you what your weaknesses are.
So true. What a pity she doesn't honestly believe this.
But true constructive criticism is just that construtive. It contains solutions to help you fix things. It doesn’t just bitch at you.
This would be more credible if people had not been suggesting solutions for years--fewer sex scenes, more plot, an end to the ardeur, killing off or eliminating the excess characters. The problem is that Laurenita doesn't LIKE these solutions and considers them bitching. She doesn't seem to understand that just because she doesn't like something, that doesn't make the suggestion invalid.
Fifth, the dominant personality. Beware of a group where one, or two people, but usually one, does all the talking.
You mean like with you and your entourage?
They’re
Their.
opinion is the only one allowed, and their critique is the only one that counts. If anyone disagrees with them, they get shouted down, or humiliated until they give up on giving an opinion that is different from the dominant person.
Is she actually admitting that the troos are wrong?
Most of these people are just in the group to make themselves feel wonderful, usually at your expense, and they tend to have one, or two, members of the group that are simply there as their Greek chorus. A sort of, "Yes, Sophocles," thing. This group is crippled by their pet Sophocles, leave him and his chorus to their little stroke party and find a group that actually encourages opinions.
She IS talking about her forums!
This is advice that was hard won for me over the years from personal experience. I hope it helps some of you not have to go through what I endured before I found my own writing group, the Alternate Historians.
Here's their website: http://www.sff.net/people/marella/
We’ll be celebrating twenty years as a group. Between us all we have over forty books, and innumerable short stories published. Not bad for a group of people that hadn’t sold anything when we met. (The exception being Sharon Shinn, who had sold several books before she joined us. Our good fortune to have her with us.)
Shinn must have joined later than the others, then. The Alternate Historians were founded in 1988. Shinn got an award for best first fantasy novel in 1996. The book was The Shape-Changer's Wife.
No, the advice makes sense. It's Laurell's hypocrisy that bothers me, for she manifestly doesn't believe some of this and creatively interprets other bits.
Entry: Writing groups
Link: http://blog.laurellkhamilton.org/2008/07/writing-groups.html
We keep getting asked how to tell if a writing group is a good group.
Really? Who asks? Because according to a previous post of yours, you only recently went back to a writing group after three or four years away.
First, are people actually writing, or just talking about writing.
End a question with a question mark.
Talk is great, and if all you want to do is hang out with other people that want to talk about writing that’s fine, but be wary. Writers don’t just talk about writing; they write.
...says the woman who's been complaining since February about not being able to write a certain scene.
Second, sometimes it’s hard to be in a group if you write genre of any kind. A lot of writing groups are sort of snoppish.
I don't know if she means "snappish," "snobbish" or is trying to create a portmanteau word meaning both.
Any group that tells you that what you want to write is bad just because it’s horror, or science fiction, or romance, or mystery, or any other genre, is not the group for you. Don’t let anyone talk you out of what you know in your heart is what speaks to your muse. If the group doesn’t approve of your type of writing, then find a different group.
On the other hand, lots of groups specializing in genre writing exist, so finding a group that favors your kind of writing shouldn't be that hard.
Third, beware of sharks. Sharks are people that are just in the group to draw blood. They do nothing but criticize in the most vicious terms. They say they’re giving you constructive criticism and trying to help, but trust me, sharks are interested only in destruction and hurting. Some sharks throw off all pretense and begin to attack the writer personally, and not the writing. These are people that are only interested in causing you pain. Any group that tolerates people like this you do not want to be a part of.
Why, Lashers! I do believe she's talking about us!
Fourth, the group that only says good things. If you’ve written something good, then it’s nice to know, but no one is perfect, especially at the beginning. If you get nothing but praise then you can’t improve your writing, because you don’t have any feedback telling you what your weaknesses are.
So true. What a pity she doesn't honestly believe this.
But true constructive criticism is just that construtive. It contains solutions to help you fix things. It doesn’t just bitch at you.
This would be more credible if people had not been suggesting solutions for years--fewer sex scenes, more plot, an end to the ardeur, killing off or eliminating the excess characters. The problem is that Laurenita doesn't LIKE these solutions and considers them bitching. She doesn't seem to understand that just because she doesn't like something, that doesn't make the suggestion invalid.
Fifth, the dominant personality. Beware of a group where one, or two people, but usually one, does all the talking.
You mean like with you and your entourage?
They’re
Their.
opinion is the only one allowed, and their critique is the only one that counts. If anyone disagrees with them, they get shouted down, or humiliated until they give up on giving an opinion that is different from the dominant person.
Is she actually admitting that the troos are wrong?
Most of these people are just in the group to make themselves feel wonderful, usually at your expense, and they tend to have one, or two, members of the group that are simply there as their Greek chorus. A sort of, "Yes, Sophocles," thing. This group is crippled by their pet Sophocles, leave him and his chorus to their little stroke party and find a group that actually encourages opinions.
She IS talking about her forums!
This is advice that was hard won for me over the years from personal experience. I hope it helps some of you not have to go through what I endured before I found my own writing group, the Alternate Historians.
Here's their website: http://www.sff.net/people/marella/
We’ll be celebrating twenty years as a group. Between us all we have over forty books, and innumerable short stories published. Not bad for a group of people that hadn’t sold anything when we met. (The exception being Sharon Shinn, who had sold several books before she joined us. Our good fortune to have her with us.)
Shinn must have joined later than the others, then. The Alternate Historians were founded in 1988. Shinn got an award for best first fantasy novel in 1996. The book was The Shape-Changer's Wife.
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no subject
Date: 2008-07-03 01:53 pm (UTC)Who is this "we" she keeps referring to in her blogs? I can't imagine that anyone would be asking non-writers Jon and Darla for writing advice. I truly can't imagine anyone asking crap writer LKH for writing advice either.
no subject
Date: 2008-07-03 03:08 pm (UTC)On the other hand, Darla and Jon seem to think they're writers by association, so maybe.
no subject
Date: 2008-07-03 11:25 pm (UTC)b) Laurell and her loyal syncophants.
c) Merry, Anita, and the rest of the Happy Humpers who live in Laurell's head.
d) The lurkers who support her in e-mail. I can't believe I almost forgot about those.
no subject
Date: 2008-07-04 06:22 am (UTC)