Kiss the Dead: Linked Amazon bookflog

[rodentfanatic.livejournal.com]

Remember the Kiss the Dead bookflog that I mentioned coming across in my last post?

For those interested, I went back and found the same bookflog so you all can enjoy it as well!
http://www.amazon.com/Kiss-The-Dead-Book-Flog/forum/FxTO3NBR31RJME/TxJHAGA5M4KT3Z/1/ref=cm_cd_fp_ef_tft_tp?_encoding=UTF8&asin=0425247546&tag=5336432714-20

The highlights (in my opinion) include...

* Anita interrogating a vampire and getting her three-inch stiletto heel stuck in his chest when she kicks him so that when he falls backward, she gets taken with him and her thong panties get shown to everyone, teehee! How awful! This is surely a way of making Anita seem flawed (hint, flaws do not mean 'totally incompetent at something you're supposed to be the best at' like Anita supposedly is at dealing with vampires) and not an excuse to show off her sexy undies to all the boys without her MEANING to flash them. Gad, can you imagine the old Anita showing up to work in heels at all, let alone heels with a miniskirt and thigh-high stockings? There's really no job outside the sex industry I can think of where that's anywhere near office-appropriate, let alone when doing police work.

* She can apparently feed on rage now? Rage that is like cupcakes? Anita, I thought you were a living member of Belle Morte's bloodline, not the Dragon's? But feel free to switch if you like, at least the Dragon doesn't carry that ardeur nonsense!

* Apparently, vampires label the four vampire hunters they fear most after the Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse. Naturally, Anita is one of these. She, ever-modest, says "Let me guess, I'm Death" and the vampire tells her that's Edward (DUH) and that Anita is War because she's killed more vampires than Death. Um, what? Listen, whether you die from war, famine, or plague, you still DIE. Death gets you in the end regardless of cause, therefore shouldn't Death be the label for the hunter who has killed the most?

* Anita looks at a vampire boy she doesn't know and wonders why his hair isn't longer. GEE MAYBE BECAUSE MOST GUYS, DEAD OR ALIVE, ARE NOT TRYING TO BE RAPUNZEL LIKE YOUR HAREM? And then finds out JC steals energy from other vampires to grow his own hair, lololol forever.

* Bitchy jealous bimbos hate Anita because they think she is going out with some hot new police guy she's just met who wants to learn how to kill monsters from Anita and divulges he is actually a gay man in the closet (not much of a closet if you're telling people you've just met?). He agrees to date said bitchy jealous bimbos so they will stop being mean to Anita over him. Wut.

* Remember Cynric? That teenaged weretiger who is Anita's blue tiger to call (because she has a tiger to call of each color!) and who likes to be called Cyn (pronounced Sin)? Hooray, he's eighteen now! Yes, he wasn't before. Ew. Although to be honest, him now being eighteen does NOT make anything about his relationship with Anita better. See, Anita and JC are acting as his guardians (JC legally his guardian, Anita doing mommy stuff for him) and he's living with them (along with the other sweeties) and Anita goes to his PTA meetings like his mom because he is still in high school. Apparently it makes her feel awkward to be doing this AND banging him. UH WELL IT SHOULD. God you are a fucking skeezy sexual predator, Anita. It gets even worse when one considers this tidbit from Cyn's entry on an AB Wiki: "Cynric's youth makes him particularly vulnerable to the way Anita forges metaphysically bonds with her servants, leaving Cynric besotted with her for an unknown length of time. His level of devotion, however, does not appear to entirely remove his free will." Oh, not ENTIRELY? Just partly then? Well then that's just hunky-dory and not creepy/rapey at all, carry on! Which you have been since he was just a junior (he's now a senior) which makes me wonder why you're just NOW feeling weird about it.

* At the end of the book it is noted that Nathaniel is teaching Cynric how to strip-tease so he can do a private dance for Anita. THERE IS NOT ENOUGH NO IN THE WORLD.

* Anita thinks that using a ball-gag in bondage takes away the ability of the sub to say no. NOT HOW IT WORKS, HONEY. Helloooo, non-verbal signals? I thought you did ~research~ on this stuff, Hamilton?

* Nicky the lion, who used to be a bad guy until, according to an AB wiki, she "roll his mind completely, making him her slave" which he "does not seem to mind" is now the Rex of the werelions. Because having your leader be the slave of someone else is exactly what any group of wereanimals would want. And I guess that makes her the Regina, of course? Oh, and the term for such a slave is being a Bride, as in Bride of Dracula, nevermind that the three lady vamps in the novel were never actually referred to as such and people just started calling them that later. In addition to this being stupid as fuck, I guess Anita could never have a groom, because that would make her the bride, how girly, ew, she's Prince Charming dammit!

* Anita's gold tiger to call is a guy named Mephistopheles. Since that's such a mouthful, he's usually called Devil or just Dev. His sister is named Good Angel. Seriously. He and Anita have sex, then instead of cleaning up they decide to just nap as they are. When they awake, they find that this has resulted in the condom they used being glued INSIDE Anita and to his genitals. I cannot make this up.

* I have like zero idea what the actual plot is aside from it getting a few chapters in the beginning, wrapped up in a few chapters at the end, and the rest of the book having nothing to do with it at all. Oh yeah, and Asher is the new Richard.

Comments

[c-l-craft.livejournal.com]

How in the world could anyone think what she has going on with Nicky is okay?! That's child abuse, and it's frankly disgusting that someone thought it would be a good idea to include it as a healthy relationship. Anyone who thinks that's a good idea is a bad person.

Your right, there is not enough NO in the world.



I'm pretty sure Anita is out monstering some of her own villains at this point.

[rodentfanatic.livejournal.com]

Mind-enslaved sex pets, one of whom is a high school boy? Oh pssh-tosh, that's not at all something that the villains of this 'vese would d--wait, oh no, they totally have and would and it was presented as the terrible thing that it is. but it's ok here cuz she wuvs them and they like it! REALLY THEY LIKE IT, THAT CAN'T POSSIBLY BE THE MIND-ENSLAVED BIT TALKING

[snarky-imp.livejournal.com]

I've been trying to read this for about the last two weeks. It's killing me each time I even look at the book. I'm only a third of the way into it (maybe a little less?) and I've already had to make notes and walk away to scream about how awful things are. There's the Cynric thing, there's the trying to pass Nicky off as a healthy relationship (and this is just in passing), but it's actually her destroying Larry's character that's driving me to drink.

How does not wanting to do something you consider evil translate into being the bad guy here? HOW?

I honestly think I'm going to finish this (because unfinished books make me twitchy) and then I'm done. Not done but will still read them when they come out, but flat out done. There's nothing left for me here other than high blood pressure.

[rodentfanatic.livejournal.com]

I salute you for getting this far. I had to stop after NiC and keep up through book flogs, fan wikis, and this comm. It makes things a hell of a lot lulzier than just reading the fail straight from the source.

Ugh, poor Larry D8

[jya-bd-cp-ttgb.livejournal.com]

I read the damn thing and can't remember three words of it without a teleprompter. Has my brain failed or they just suck that bad now?

[daphne-gateau.livejournal.com]

How on earth does she or her publisher get away with this Cynric storyline business? That's not edgy or just disturbing. Anita is abusive, predatory and manipulative. Playing a parental role, portraying herself as an involved school mom to cover up the grooming of a vulnerable and impressionable youth for nothing more than her own greed, desires and benefit. How does her publisher allow such an irresponsible portrayal of this scenario? Perhaps this is more common in fiction than I realize, but I am surprised there isn't more of a controversy surrounding it. Especially since LKH is so successful and.. I guess popular. Does anyone have an example of a lucrative popular series featuring a male protag grooming underage girls to join his harem?

I know it wouldn't be published if there weren't a market. I'm just surprised there IS such a large market out there for something that so clearly crosses the established lines of morality and criminality. No one seems to be having a conversation about it's appropriateness or exploitative treatment in cheap toss away popular lit outside of a few communities and blogs (and I'm assuming the Amazon comment section). I'm sure she's not writing this scenario to deeply explore the issue or to even mildly suggest Anita isn't completely in the right. Nate teaching this kid to strip is just so, so sad and I doubt there was even one fleeting reflective thought from Anita (or the author) as to why that might be. LKH is just writing this for her own fantasy pay off, because she thinks (and I guess her readers agree?) it's cool and totally okay because 'it's just fiction'.

[rodentfanatic.livejournal.com]

Ditto, it's really downright scary.

[shadwing.livejournal.com]

A REALLY (as in SCARY) devoted fan got into a long and heated debate about this on the Amazon boards and kept couching it in the following ways

- Cynric was never an 'illegal age' , the AoC in Nevada was 16, and he didn't come to St Louis till he was 17 which was the AoC of MO
- Anita is NOT his guardian....JC is.
- Cynric's parents are okay with it
- Cynric is in love with Anita.
- Anita doesn't REALLY want Cynric...but she doesn't want to HURT him.

And kept avoiding the following-
- Cynric is STILL at least a decade younger than Anita.
- She's a US marshal, and boinking your SO's Ward on the side while not illegal (due to age) would DEFINATLY be side eyed something fierce by her co-workers and superiors
- And if she doesn't want Cynric around and groomed to 'please her' why doesn't she DO something about it. Like telling JC off for accepting the guardianship of him...ripping Nate a new one for daring to teach him out to strip and dance to 'please her'
- Anita's silence to everybody involved in this mess is her approval and acceptance of Cynric as a lover.

IE the troos are using double speak and loopholes to justify her relationship to 'Cyn'

[plastraa.livejournal.com]

"Does anyone have an example of a lucrative popular series featuring a male protag grooming underage girls to join his harem?"

Ok so maybe this isn't 100% parallel (because, ostensibly, he isn't trying to sex her up) but Edward in Twilight is 100+ years old and he creeps on little miss Bella a lot. And watches her sleep, and plays with her mind (and there didn't seem to be a lot there to play with, but, yeah) etc. So in a way yes....grooming a young girl. :-\ (TO be fair I have to admit, I couldn't make my way through that series either. I read about 200 pages of the first book, and it took me over a month to get that far. So I relied on blogs etc for info and sporking!)

[ladymina.livejournal.com]

I think it is about the troos that can't give up the universe she built in the beginning - They have become rabid in their try to 'protect' the author from bad reviews and disgruntled former fans and stopped having original thoughts
About the old-timers who occasionally check if she got a handle on the insanity that took over that universe

At least with Anita Blake
It makes it easier for her to push it because she has an established fanbase that is loath to give her up one way or another.
And nearly everyone who'd be critical enough already gave her up about the dub con issues with the adeur

[plastraa.livejournal.com]

If I still read the books I'd be waiting for Chris Hansen (to catch a predator) to show up in her kitchen.

All the non/dub-con she's having with her 'harem' is frankly not edgy and showing what a strong women she is, bucking convention and having lots of men. I don't believe in 'slut shaming', I don't think there is anything wrong with women having sex with any one who has the ability to make an informed decision.

Unfortunately with Anita it's at the very least exploitative but I think it's sexual abuse and she is a rapist. (that's not cute, or edgy, or special)

The men can't consent, either because of age, or because of the ardeur...so either way non-consensual. And the ones that aren't non-consensual are at least dubious (everyone knows she's willing to kill people who won't toe the line, remember the were lions). Nothing's sexier than having to get it up on pain of death...huh, wow sexy. I'm turned on right now. :-|

Like I've said elsewhere, she's hit monster status long ago.

I wish that LKH would stop writing her as the protagonist of this piece, and admit to what she is. I might even read the books again, if she was considered the monster and then Edward could get out of the PTA and come kill her! (End Series!)

[rodentfanatic.livejournal.com]

Yup. The amount of sex she has and the number of men she has it with aren't a moral problem at all (just a writing problem because it's too damn many characters and the sex eclipses the plot), the fact that she's a domestic abuser, rapist, and just plain awful partner (for instance, expecting them to be celibate for her) are the issue as far as I'm concerned. And ahaha, funny, a friend of mine was just saying the same thing to me this morning about how he wants Anita to be the new bad guy (which she really already is even if LKH doesn't think so) and have Edward take her out!

[plastraa.livejournal.com]

OK I just have to put a disclaimer here a bit, because consent issues are a super trigger with me. And lots of popular fiction today seems to be rife with it. 50 shades is another one I can't read, because her lack of self esteem and issues of self worth, makes her consent impossible as well.

JUST so much. I'm not sure why exploitative relationships seem to be so popular right now in fiction. BUT I would like to see an actual women in lit who is well adjusted, and capable of making informed consent have sex with loads of equally well adjusted dudes or women...and maybe go out and kick some supernatural ass, OR even better, have loads of sex, but it done off screen, and we get an actual PLOT!

BUT I guess where's the fun in that?

[kyoko-minamino.livejournal.com]

The thought of Edward killing her and ending the series is by far the happiest ending I could ever conjure in my mind. Thank you for that.

[ladymina.livejournal.com]

I liked the idea of the edgy multiple sex partner thing with her Merry Gentry series - until that also fell into the dub-con/non-con area even if it usually does not feel as bad as with Anita, as the power is not with Merry but with Andais (as far as I read the series before I swore off of everything LKH)
So the harem idea is not the problem
But I am very very uncomfortable with the way Anita gets her sex with most of her not so willing posse

[pearkiwi.livejournal.com]

Poor Asher. He was so awesome when he first showed up, too.

[subtle-shades.livejournal.com]

*LOVES ASHER SO HARD*

[subtle-shades.livejournal.com]

Anita/LKH and the fangirl are deeply, deeply mistaken.

1.) I've just looked at the Nevada state statutes for age of consent, consent as regards to people in authority over the minor child, and the interstate adoption/placement compact agreement and, after about fifteen minutes of consideration, am fairly certain that Anita, Jean-Claude and everyone associated with the teenager's living conditions is in violation of Nevada's criminal and civil statutes. Jail time, by the way, is nonnegotiable in some of these statutes. Age of Consent isn't nearly as simple as most people think.

2.) Before you say "But wait! He's in MISSOURI not NEVADA!" Nevada's laws still apply as stated in the interstate compact agreement for the placement of children. This assumes, however, that Cyrnic is a ward of the state.

3.) Side note, Nevada has a Contributing to the Delinquency and Neglect of a Child statute. And, even if he can consent to sexual activity, the boy is under 18 and thus this applies.

4.) I could look into it if you want but, judging by their statutes' titles, Nevada seems to have differentiated between same-sex contact and hetero-contact. This law would probably not cut in any orgy's favor. And again, I say unto you, strict liability, sex with a minor, position of authority, interstate compact agreement for placement of children.

5.) If he has parents and they're letting this go on, they can share Anita's cell.

6.) It doesn't matter if he's in love or Anita is or if Anita has... "good intentions"... if you can have those about exploiting and grooming a kid... in sexing up a minor. When sex occurs with minors, and at sixteen/seventeen he's still under 18 which is the age of adulthood in most states, including Nevada, strict liability is always on the table unless stated otherwise. Strict liability laws don't care about that 'in love' nonsense. They are strictly 'Did you do X? Yes = Mandatory punishment."

7.) Also, Patty Hurst thought she was in love and look how that turned out for her.

On another note, if the supernatural were real, people like Nicky would be protected. Powers like Anita's mind-crushing one would most likely carry steep strict liability punishments.

And, finally, all of the sex details creep me out. ALL OF THEM.

EDIT: EDWARD RULES! OF COURSE HE HAS THE HIGHEST NUMBER!

[shadwing.livejournal.com]

Gods alll of this!

We kept screaming at the Troo "He's still a MINOR, she's an ADULT it is WRONG on a moral level!"

At the very least her relationship with Cynric should have cost her Marshal status, letter of the law or no...the US Marshals would not want a member who was having sexual relations with a minor then took said minor over state lines to continue the relationship, FULL STOP. At best she'd just lose her badge...at worst she'd be in jail.

[plastraa.livejournal.com]

On a less serious note than my other 'consent issue' outrages...the whole JC stealing energy from people to keep his hair nice and shiny. SIGH! There are products for that you know, professional hair care products? AND even if his hair reverts to whatever state it was when he died every night past midnight, he could still get a weave for crying out loud! Everyone and their aunt betty has a weave these days...and only his hair dresser would have to know for sure, right?

So much.

[subtle-shades.livejournal.com]

I don't understand why his hair doesn't grow. I believe that hair and nails continue growing for a bit after death.

...I'm not actually sure how feasible the 'battery method' of vampirism is here. Theoretically, if you killed off about a dozen key vampires, all of the little batteries should die. So that should make taking power from those little batteries next to impossible since they suck it up, not put it out.

But yeah, it's a tiny, petty example of what leads to people getting raped and all of the energy being sucked out of their followers.

[kisstheground.livejournal.com]

two days later and i've read the whole thread! still very much wtfing at all of it-- granted, i'm the person who read the first book, half of the second and got bored, and only keep up through sporks, but HOLY SHIT BALLS, SON.

there ARE interesting ideas in there (there always are with lkh) but everything is so half-assed or let go of, it's shocking. i get that first person pov is unreliable, and in the hands of a talented writer, it can be marvelous, but, um... that is not what is happening here. anita finding sleeping with an 18 year old acceptable =/= the rest of the UNIVERSE finding it okay.

[rodentfanatic.livejournal.com]

Yeah, it's the fact that there are these little gems of interesting notions in the stew of shit that both saddens me and keeps me keen to find out where the series ultimately goes.

And yeah, the thing about first person POV is that it's inherently unreliable, or at least is supposed to be. LKH seems to miss this, and makes Anita's view line up exactly with how reality (in this series) is. For instance, she thinks feminine women are sluts and victims...and she's always right. She thinks blondes are evil...and she's always right. She thinks cops only have problems with her because they're racists or slut-shamers, even though there are SO many other reasons they should have to not like her...and yet again, always shown to be right. She should really try reading something by Nabokov (like Lolita or Despair) to get a better idea of how to write a proper unreliable narrator.

[kyoko-minamino.livejournal.com]

I'm impressed you managed to get through this enough to recap events. I got halfway down this list before wailing, "WHY AM I READING THIS?!" out loud and scaring my cat. Sweet flaky Jeebus, this is awful. LKH just keeps inventing ways to get more terrible. Maybe she and Satan have a bet going of how far she can buttfuck her series into the Point of No Return. [/bitter]

[rodentfanatic.livejournal.com]

sure would explain a lot...

[astronauta.livejournal.com]

I was actually excited when I first started reading the book, because it felt like she was returning to her police procedural writing and I felt there was going to be a lot going on with the whole "vampires don't want to pay their mandatory dues to Jean-Claude anymore". Alas. That whole plot sort of died off the moment she captured the vampires, which happened.. when? One-third of the way in?

I think I would have really liked the book if someone actually died at the end there during that random bomb threat. Someone significant, like Nathaniel. Better yet - the entire group that was inside the vicinity. It would have been the next AB book really interesting - Anita dealing with actual loss. Every one of those characters are insignificant to the progress of the series, but significant enough to affect Anita.

[shadwing.livejournal.com]

YES a few deaths would go along way to restoring LKH's cred as a writer, and bringing some heavy confict back into the books.

I was kinda hoping Nicky would die...since that could be tied directly to Anita's carelessness and ignorance and she would have no wiggle room to get out of it.

[aikaterini.livejournal.com]

/This is surely a way of making Anita seem flawed (hint, flaws do not mean 'totally incompetent at something you're supposed to be the best at' like Anita supposedly is at dealing with vampires) and not an excuse to show off her sexy undies to all the boys without her MEANING to flash them./

Ms. Hamilton, just give it up already. We all know that you want Anita to be this totally wanton and sizzling hot woman. Stop pretending otherwise. You’re not fooling anybody.

/Anita looks at a vampire boy she doesn't know and wonders why his hair isn't longer. GEE MAYBE BECAUSE MOST GUYS, DEAD OR ALIVE, ARE NOT TRYING TO BE RAPUNZEL LIKE YOUR HAREM?/

*face-palm* My Lord, how much of a self-absorbed control freak is this woman? Is she so used to getting her way when it comes to her harem that she’s developed this bubble around herself about how the world’s supposed to be, which shatters when she has to confront reality? Earth to Anita: the world does not revolve around you! People have many tastes and preferences that are different from yours! People don’t care what you think about their choices! Shocking, I know.

/He agrees to date said bitchy jealous bimbos so they will stop being mean to Anita over him./

So…he’ll date people that he has no chance in being romantically/sexually interested in…just for Anita’s sake. Wow, then I guess that I was wrong. The world really does revolve around Anita Blake and everyone twists themselves to fit her needs. I guess that that vampire boy is now throwing away his scissors and canceling his barber appointments.

/Although to be honest, him now being eighteen does NOT make anything about his relationship with Anita better. See, Anita and JC are acting as his guardians (JC legally his guardian, Anita doing mommy stuff for him) and he's living with them (along with the other sweeties) and Anita goes to his PTA meetings like his mom because he is still in high school. Apparently it makes her feel awkward to be doing this AND banging him. UH WELL IT SHOULD./

0_0

She…goes to his PTA meetings? And she’s *sleeping with him?*

Earth to Ms. Hamilton, this is *wrong!* So very wrong! It’s the Oedipus Complex and Jocasta Complex rolled into one disgusting ball of ephebophilia and sexual predation. It’s sleazy and creepy and just plain *wrong.* And feeling awkward means nothing if you keep *doing* it!

/At the end of the book it is noted that Nathaniel is teaching Cynric how to strip-tease so he can do a private dance for Anita. THERE IS NOT ENOUGH NO IN THE WORLD./

*stares at the screen*

This…this is sad, guys. This is truly sad and depressing. It just – there is no way to excuse this. No way to say that this isn’t exploitative and abusive and disgusting. Anita is a sexual predator, a sex offender, and a child rapist. And this whole thing is revolting. End of story.

[rodentfanatic.livejournal.com]

So…he’ll date people that he has no chance in being romantically/sexually interested in…just for Anita’s sake. Wow, then I guess that I was wrong. The world really does revolve around Anita Blake and everyone twists themselves to fit her needs.

That indeed seems to be the case! Her blatant narcissism, like her misogyny, would be a great character flaw if not for the fact that in this reality, she's completely RIGHT and thus it's not a flaw at all, she's seeing things exactly how they are as Hamilton writes them---that everything is about her, that other women suck, etc.

[duamuteffe.livejournal.com]

Hello! I have been stalking this group for several months now, but this book ("book") has been the final straw after which I had to set up an account and join the fun. I have a high tolerance for crap, honed on many, many hours of MST3K viewings, and normally I can handle the standard AB level of garbage. But it was the continued insistence that the whole Cynric thing is terrific and justified that finally caused me to set it down for a while and seriously consider getting a shower. Several showers. It was bad enough when it started, but now, as has been mentioned, Nathaniel's grooming him to be his underage successor and that's just seventeen extra levels of *not okay* in any way, shape or form.
When it first happened I remember thinking, "Oh, your teenage daughter is bringing boyfriends home and you're feeling your age, " and assuming that one little mind-controlled blackout fling in Vegas would be the end of it. But nooo, he's still there, trying ever so hard to be acceptable because he looooves her (Why? Why? She doesn't have hobbies you can share! She doesn't have interests that don't involve dick! You're not learning how to have a relationship! You don't get to be an equal participant when your girlfriend goes to your parent-teacher conferences!) Gah!
I'm sorry; it's been building up a while. Anyway, hello, glad to be aboard the Crazy Train Observatory with you all!

[rodentfanatic.livejournal.com]

Hey welcome! No worries, let it all out, you're completely right, there's nothing okay or equal about this relationship, and we're glad to have someone else on-board who will say so!

[ladymina.livejournal.com]

About the only thing I get is that Anita can not be Death - for the simple reason, that that was Edwards Name since the early books.

And War fits, she is waging war on everyone, including her own people, leaving devastation behind in all the survivors on both side of the issue (her side loses the will to live and becomes puppet persons to fuck her)

Sure, she researched BDSM and gags ... in a calender like all her other research *rollseyes*

And the rest ewww eeeww and that is not how it works with more eeew and ick in it

[rodentfanatic.livejournal.com]

Oh, War fits for those reasons certainly, but not for the reason the vampire gave ("You've killed more of us than Death").

LOL THE CALENDARS. THAT NEVER GETS OLD TO ME.